'The problem is that Jewish Americans don't know Israel'

Jewish American thinker Leon Wieseltier tells Israel Hayom that he opposes settlements (they poison relations), that Obama "makes America small" (nobody likes him), and that Jewish Americans are ignorant (you can't raise Jewish children on Seinfeld).

Dror Eydar

"There is anti-Semitism in America, and there always will be, but it will never be seen as legitimate," says Leon Wieseltier 

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 Photo credit: Yehonatan Shaul

Anyone who meets Leon Wieseltier is guaranteed to be ill at ease. I met him at a conference of the Global Forum of the National Library of Israel, which he co-chairs. Wieseltier has also been the literary editor of the prestigious publication The New Republic for over 30 years, and is one of the most prominent thinkers in the U.S. today. He studied at a yeshiva in Brooklyn as a young man, and then attended Columbia University and later Harvard and Oxford universities. He won the National Jewish Book Award for his book, "Kaddish." He made a guest appearance on the legendary television series "The Sopranos." Generally speaking, in every debate on American Jewry, sooner or later his name will be mentioned.

Very few Jewish intellectuals who feel at home talking about the origins and ancient characters of Jewish civilization are then able to land in Israel, in the here and now, and talk about the sweaty Israeli political reality with as much ease. Wieseltier, 64, is fluent in Shakespearean English, but also speaks excellent Hebrew. During our conversation, which at times became a heated debate, we referred to important works and texts from generations of Jewish literature, the Bible, the Mishnah, the Talmud, and the commentators of the Middle Ages, as well as modern Hebrew literature. It was a conversation with a learned student.

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I choose to begin the conversation with the negative opinion held by many cultural figures of our day, not just in Israel but also among American Jews, in regard to Israel and the Jewish people. I ask him whether this stance reminds him of Julien Benda's "La Trahison des Clercs" ("The Treason of the Intellectuals") from 1927. They only have negative things to say, I tell him. We have had enough. Don't the Jews need some comforting and encouragement?

"The truth is that not only do we need encouragement, there is a factual foundation for encouragement," Wieseltier says. "I wouldn't say that it is the treason of the intellectuals; the problem is that most Jewish Americans don't even know this place. All they know about Israel is the myth of conflict. They don't speak Hebrew. They don't know the Israeli culture. They have no idea. They know Yehuda Amichai, A.B. Yehoshua, David Grossman, whatever is translated into English, but they are illiterate. The problem is that in order to know this land, you need to be familiar with the Bible and speak Hebrew, and know a little Jewish history, otherwise you are a tourist in your own country."

Q. What do you think about the apocalyptic discourse that has developed here and in the U.S. in regard to Israel's future?

"I don't see the situation in Israel as apocalyptic. On the other hand, I respect the concerns. There is good reason for concern. If we are talking about peace or reconciliation with our neighbors, there isn't much basis for hope at this time, on either side. I blame both sides."

Why do you blame us?

"In the past, I did not agree with the Left's assertion that the biggest obstacle standing in the way of peace was the settlements. Today, I think that the settlements are insane because they poison our relationship with the population that Israel has no choice but to live with."

Putting "poisoned" relationships aside, why do you assume that the other population is actually interested in peace?

"It is true that they are currently not interested in peace. But they are not going anywhere."

To say that the settlements are the problem -- you have an entire region that is falling to pieces, and the only Arab oasis of peace is the Palestinians. We are protecting them, with the Israel Defense Forces all around them. The IDF is there because of the settlements. If there weren't settlements there, we would have an Islamic caliphate in the Samarian hills right now posing an enormous threat to us. If there were no Jewish communities there, the IDF would not be there either.

"So they can live in the Galilee. This is the State of Israel, they have a right to be there [in the settlements], but I also have the right to jump off the roof -- it would not be intelligent for me to jump off the roof."

I don't understand you. Why not be there?

"The state was established in 1948, but now the period of establishment and creation is over. Now we are in a period of protecting the state, developing ourselves culturally and economically, and making this a great place. 1948 was not just an important milestone on the way to realizing some maximalist vision dreamed up by Zeev Jabotinsky or Rabbi Abraham Isaac Kook or the Biblical Abraham. Borders are important to me only in terms of security, not in terms of ideology."

And what about Jerusalem?

"When it comes to Jerusalem I am definitely a hawk."

But everyone agrees that there is no solution to the conflict without Jerusalem. Jerusalem is viewed as a settlement.

"First of all, the mere mention of Jerusalem destroys any chance for dialogue. If the Arabs had wanted to hold on to half of Jerusalem, they shouldn't have attacked in 1967. On the other hand, we need to find some kind of solution. I believe that if there is ever an opening, things can be worked out."

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